SALUTATIONS
Last week's issue sparked a terrific discussion about the identities
of Elizabeth Taliaferro and Katherine Grymes the healthiest, most informative
thing we can do. We have embarked upon, I believe - I hope - is a
challenge to work toward clearing up long lingering questions about the
Taliaferro family history, injecting additional meaning to these words:
"The aim of argument, or of discussion,
should not be victory, but progress."....Joseph Joubert
NEW MEMBERS
DONNA HUNTER (DHunter365)My Taliaferro ancestor was Lyne S. Taliaferro b. Sept. 27, 1795 in Amherst Co., VA, d. Dec. 15, 1871 in Haywood Co., TN. He married Mildred Taylor Taliaferro, daughter of Benjamin and Mildred Taylor Franklin Taliaferro. Lyne S. was son of John and Betsy Loving Taliaferro. I am especially interested in information on Mildred Taylor Franklin and her father James Franklin.
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ANNE (THORNTON) HAMLIN (AHamlin777)
***** Both my husband, Ron and I were born in Huntington, WV and grew
up there. We lived in Lawton, Oklahoma (Fort Sill) where Ron was stationed
while in the service, and both our children were born there. After
the stint in the service, we moved back to our hometown where I finished
school at Marshall University & several years later we moved to Knoxville,
TN . We now have two children & one grandchild... Ron is a maintenance
manager for a condominium here & I'm a cytotechnologist at UT Hospital.
My Taliaferro ties come from my father's side of the family. There
are two that I am aware of:
First, I descend from John Taliaferro (Son of 1 Robert)& Sarah SMITH > Lawrence Taliaferro & Sarah THORNTON > Francis Taliaferro & Elizabeth HAY > Lawrence Taliaferro & Mary JACKSON > Sarah Taliaferro & Francis DADE > Lawrence T. DADE & Anne MAYO > Mary Jackson DADE & Daniel McCarty Fitzhugh THORNTON.... (My 3great grandparents) If anyone needs information on this line, I would be happy to share what I have.
Second: Sarah TALIAFERRO b. 1728, 1st wife of Anthony THORNTON b. 1727 of Ormesby, Caroline County. I have not been able to find out who this Sarah Taliaferro's parents are. She & Anthony Thornton are the grandparents of Daniel Mc. Fitz. Thornton mentioned above.
My queries: Please let me know if anyone has any idea who the parents are for: Sarah Taliaferro b. 1728 d. Feb. 6, 1762. Married Anthony Thornton of Ormesby, Caroline Co. Dec. 31, 1746.
QUERIES
JEAN (RSD1145)
*****
I am stumped. Carol submits that Sallie (Sarah) Taliaferro and
Daniel Harvie had two children. I have that their daughter
was Francis Taliaferro Harvie, b. 1794. Can anyone confirm this for
me? I'm panicked. Thanks.
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DON GHOLSTON (DGholston)
*****
Who were the parents of Mary Taliaferro, born 1686 on Powhatan Plantation,
Essex Co. VA, and married Francis Thornton, Jr.? They had a daughter, Elizabeth
(among others).
I am related to the Savage, Thornton, Gaines and Jamison families through my Meriwether line and related to the Jefferson, Branch, Farrar and Baugh families through my Howard line. Through my GGG grandfather, Dabney Gholston, I am related to the Bullock, Henley and Hawkins families, and through my GGGG grandfather, Anthony Gholston, Jr., the Sandridge (Sandige) and Pulliam families. .All of these lines trace back to Colonial Virginia.
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DAVID WISDOM (WKPT13C@prodigy.com)
****
James Barbour married a MISS Taliaferro. Does anyone have
any data on her first name?
James Barbour was born about 1660, in Scotland, and died about 1720
in Essex county, Virginia. Miss Taliaferro must have been born
sometime between 1650 and 1670, most likely in Virginia. Is there
any data on a Taliaferro/Barbour line for the 1600s?
RESPONSES
We received an outstanding response to David Wisdom's Queries of last
week. I hope someone will take the time to evaluate and weigh the authenticity/frequency/consistency
of the information and compile an educated opinion which we can adopt as
our best understanding of the answers.
DAVID WISDOM (WKPT13C@prodigy.com)raised two questions in our last issue to which several responses were received. Thanks, David, for initiating two really good discussions which, I feel certain, will lead to the best conclusion we can reach at this time.
First Query: Seeking parents of ELIZABETH TALIAFERRO b.c.
1670s. Married John Catlett before Oct. 20, 1706, in Essex, VA.
They had child Margaret (Mary?) Catlett who married Jonathan Gibson.
John Catlett is supposed to be son of Sheriff John Catlett, Jr. and
Elizabeth Gaines. The Sheriff is the son of Colonel John Catlett
and Elizabeth Underwood.
Is the Elizabeth Taliaferro the daughter of Ranger John Taliaferro and Sarah Smith?
RESPONSES:
BETTY A. SMIDDY (103107.3363@CompuServe.COM): Query re Elizabeth Taliaferro's parents who married John Catlett. According to Tyler's Quarterly, Vol XI, p. 13 Elizabeth, dau. of Col John Taliaferro & Sarah Smith , married John Catlett. He died 1739.
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ANNE HAMLIN (AHamlin777)
*****
I am sending what I have as far as Elizabeth Taliaferro who married
John Catlett & their family in answer to David Wisdom's query.
I have some uncertainties about it, but hopefully there will be others
will be able to verify or correct it.
John Catlett (5) b. c.1685 Old Rapphannock Co, VA : d. 1738 St. Mary's Parish, C., Va. [Source: Tylers Quarterly Mag. Vol. XI, Richmond Press, 1930.] He made a will on June 14, 1738. I did have a transcript of will, but will have to look for it if anyone would like to have it, please let me know.
Married 1st. abt 1703 Elizabeth Taliaferro b. Powhattan Plantation, Essex, VA [Source: Tylers Quarterly Mag., Vol., XI, Richmond Press, 1930.] daughter of John "the Ranger" Taliaferro & Sarah Smith (dau. of Maj. Lawrence Smith)
Child:
John Catlett (6) b. abt 1705? b. Dec 14, 1744. He
is named as the son of John Catlett (5) in his will. (I am assuming he
is the son of the first wife, E. Taliaferro because of the dates I have
for his marriage (1727) etc. Married Alice Gibson b. 1708 married
Sept. 16, 1727 d. March 15, 1761. Daughter of Johnathan Gibson, Sr.
& Elizabeth Thornton (dau. of Francis & Alice (Savage) Thornton)
Married 2nd. October 20, 1726 Spotsylvania Co., VA to Mary GRAYSON
Children: (I don't actually know whether these children should be attributed to 1st wife, Elizabeth Taliaferro or 2nd wife Mary Grayson because I have no dates for them, except an estimated one for Mary of 1727 based on birth date of her husband Johnathan Gibson, III of 1727 & their marriage date of 1748)
Benjamin Catlett - Named as son
in 1738 will of John (5) Catlett
Rubin Catlett - Named as son in
1738 will of John (5) Catlett.
William Catlett - Named as son
in 1738 will of " "
"
Judeth Catlett - Named as dau.
in 1738 will of " "
"
Elizabeth Catlett - Named as dau.
in 1738 will of " " "
Mary Catlett - Named as dau. in
the 1738 will of John (5) Catlett
+ Johnathan
Gibson, III b. 1727 m. 1748
son of
Johnathan "John" & Margaret (Catlett) Gibson, Jr. ->
I have
that this Margaret Catlett was the daughter of John Catlett
&
Elizabeth Gaines.
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DON GHOLSTON (DGholston)
******
I am puzzled by this question [about Elizabeth Catlett]. In the book,
"Adventurers of Purse and Person: Virginia 1607 - 1624/5," a footnote states
"...Margaret Bernard who married Daniel Gaines of Essex County (died 1684)
and had daughters Margaret (married successively to John Prosser, Capt.
Symon
Miller, Hugh French and John Somerville) and Elizabeth (married John
Catlett)." Is this a different Elizabeth and John?
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ELREETA WEATHERS (rrw@htcomp.net)
*****
Our research indicates that this was Elizabeth Taliaferro-5 > Lt. Col.
John Taliaferro, Sr -4 (and his wife Sarah Smith) > Robert Taliaferro-I(the
immigrant)- 3 > Francis Taliaferro - 2 > Bartholomew Taliferro of Harte
Street, London, England.
Elizabeth's father is also known as "John, the Ranger" He was a Colonel, Essex Militia in 1696; Burgess of Essex County in1699; Justice, Essex County, 1699-1700. He fought in the Indian wars and had 11 children. He was the first to bear the name "John Taliaferro" in Virginia. He was also Sheriff of Essex Co. His marriage to Sarah Smith, 1682, is proved by deed of Francis Taliaferro to his brother John, who was about to marry Sarah Smith. He was a large land holder in Essex Co. and the bricks for his beautiful home "Powhattan" were made in England.
Sarah Smith was a daughter of Major Lawrence Smith--(Old) Rappahannock
County Deeds (1682-1688), p. 7: "23 Sept., 1682-Francis Taliaferro..son
and heir of Robert Taliaferro, late...the said Robert Taliaferro and Lawrence
Smith of the county of Gloucester did patent 6,000 acres in Rappahannock
Co...now I as
heir...give 3,150 acres to my brother John Taliaferro, he being about
to marry Sarah, the daughter of said Lawrence Smith..." Recorded 7 Feb.,
1682/83. John Taliferro's will in 1715,1720 named his wife Sarah.
This Elizabeth was not born in the 1670's. Her oldest sibling was Capt. Lawrence Taliaferro, b. 1683; next was Zachariah Taliaferro, b. 1685; third, Mary Taliaferro, b. 1686; fourth, John, Jr., b. 1687; fifth, Robert, b. ?; sixth, Elizabeth b. ?; seventh, Sarah, b. ?; eighth, Capt. Richard, Sr., b. 1703/06....so Elizabeth was born after 1687 and before1703.
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Second Query: Will the real wife of immigrant ROBERT TALIAFERRO
please step forward? I have been corrected several times that she is Sarah
Katherine Deadman, born 1628 in Igtham, Kent, England and died after 1672
in Essex county, Virginia. Is this the same person as SARAH
GRYMES? Could we have a vote on her correct name?
RESPONSES:
IDELLA HOGG (IdellaH): "Gone To Texas" by W. Wayne Rogers, Bloomington,
IL 1978 says the wife of Robert Taliaferro appears to have been Katherine
Debnam, daughter of Henry and Katherine Debnam. Henry Debnam died
and Katherine remarried Rev. Charles Grymes sometime prior to 1652, making
Charles Grymes Katherine Debnam's step-father. I would be interested
in seeing what information you may have. I am of this Debnam line.
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ANN (THORNTON) HAMLIN (AHamlin777): My vote on who is Sarah
Grymes.I will have to look up what I have for a more complete explanation
& sources... but my vote is that Sarah was born: Sarah Debnam
& adpoted by her step-father Rev. Charles Grymes.
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ELREETA WEATHERS (rrw@htcomp.net): Our research concurs
that Sarah Katherine Deadmon was the name of the wife of Robert Taliaferro-I
(the immigrant) > Francis - 2 > Bartholomew Taliaferro of Harte Street,
London, England. Sarah Katherine was the daughter of Katherine and
the step-daughter
of Rev. Charles Grymes.
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BETTY A. SMIDDY (103107.3363@CompuServe.COM): Query re Elizabeth
Taliaferro's parents who married John Catlett. According to Tyler's Quarterly,
Vol XI, p. 13 Elizabeth, dau. of Col John Taliaferro & Sarah
Smith , married John Catlett. He died 1739.
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WELDON ROGERS (wwr@netdepot.com) ***** Until we get more information,
the mother of us all will have to be Katherine Debnam, daughter of William
Debnam and Sarah ?. Upon his death, Sarah Debnam married Rev. Charles Grymes.
Of her two daughters, Katherine married Robert Taliferro and Mary married
Lawrence Smith. Rev Grymes and Sarah had one additional child - John Grymes.
A William Debnam is still around in 1787 so there may have been additional
Debnam children. All the William Taliaferros owe him their given
name.
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ANONYMOUS. Here is another response to the Katherine Grymes question
- unfortunately, I am not sure who submitted it - I seem to have cut off
the name in transferring it around and apologize to the submitter.
*****
Gymes/Dedman: Robert Taliaferro m Katherine Dedman, daughter of Henry
& Katherine Dedman, and after Henry's death, she married Rev. Charles
Grymes. The child, Katherine, would have been Rev. Grymes step-daughter.
It is thought she assumed the name Grymes at an early name and went by
the name of Sarah to distinguish herself from her mother, Katherine.
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Responses to Other Issues:
JOYCE BROWNING (JBrown7169). This discussion below is in response
to the following information which appeared in the issue of 4 December:
"Robert Taliaferro,the immigrant (b. 11 Nov 1626 in London, christened
19 Nov 1626 at St. Olave's, Hart Street, London."
******
Way back in the early days of Taliaferro histrionics, someone published
that Robert Taliaferro was baptised at St. Olave's on Harte Street, London.
No doubt they really believed that what they were saying was true, or at
least that it was a reasonable assumption given the earlier litany of births
and deaths recorded in the St. Olave's Registry. However, it is not correct.
Robert Taliaferro was baptized at Stepney Parish Church, outside London,
"aged 8 days old," on 19 November 1626. Thus he was born on 11 November
1626. That was twelve years after the marriage of Francis and Bennett
Haie (Hay) Taliaferro. He had an older sister, Anne. On April
13, 1637, the family was still associated with Stepney Parish as his father,
Francis Taliaferro and William Heath were appointed by the Vestry of Stepney
Parish to carry out the responsibilities of "Sideman" for the year 1637
in the village of Milend. A "Sideman" was an assistant to the Chief
Warden of a Parish. Taliaferro and Heath were reappointed in 1638. The
Anglican church began to fall somewhat in disarray during this period as
the Puritan movement became a force in England leading to Civil War.
Francis Taliaferro died in 1646, the year the Putitan movement defeated
the Monarchy's Army.
Mile End, an ancient English village, came to be known as Bethnal Green
after it was a fashionable London surburb. It was a safe retreat
for wealthy London citizens, particularly merchants who needed to live
near the docks. The area was inland, north of the Thames River docks that
developed around
Wapping and Limelight in the 1600s.
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WELDON ROGERS (wwr@netdepot.com) as a number of good points to bring
up for discussion. Let's see where they will lead us.
Responding to JOHN C. BRANDT-KNIGHT (jbrandt@ucla.edu), Weldon says:
*****
His connections are almost as tenuous as mine. I have written him about
the Craigs. Taliaferro Craig (b 1705 and on p 1 of the 1787 'census' of
Virginia) supposedly told a grandson that he was named for a ship captain
that had his mother had as a passenger from Scotland to VA. This points
the finger at Richard Taliaferro (the pirate again) who was in the right
place at the right time.
[Note to Weldon and others from Joyce: The 1787 "Census" of Virginia is not, in fact, a census in the same sense that a federal census is. Since the 1790 and 1800 census' of Virginia were burned with the U.S. Capitol in 1812, the 1787 Virgnia property tax lists have been published to provide the best substitute available.]
The Foster connection should be checked carefully. The marriage has not been proven. Elizabeth Taliaferro c1691-1715, d/o John the Ranger and Sarah Smith, married John Catlett V 1677-1739. He m2 Mary Grayson. He was the son of John Catlett IV and a daughter of Lawrence Smith, so a first cousin once removed. Their only child/son, John Catlett VI 1705-1744 married Alice Gibson, d/o Jonathan Gibson and had 8 children. I don't have the date they moved to Culpeper and am interested in the dates and locations for any of their children, and their Johnson and Buckner marriages.
Responding to BETTY ANN SMIDDY (103107.3363@CompuServe.COM) - In re Margaret Buckner and Robert Taliaferro III c1687-1768, her name was Margaret French, d/o Hugh French. See Margaret Amundson's article in NGSQ (Sep 1995). He married 2 to Ann Pitman. If anyone has proof that her name was Buckner, Mrs. Amundson would like to know. I have her address and phone number.
COLONIAL TALLIAFERROS
WELDON ROGERS (wwr@netdepot.com) has really been busy and has sent us
this great story about Richard Talilaferro, known as "The Pirate" in some
circles.
*****
There is considerable material on Richard, son of Robert the immigrant.
Most of the basics can be found in King's 'Marriages of Richmond County
VA.'
Richard Taliaferro was a ship captain and was in London at the time
Cadwallader Jones was there angling for a position in the Barbados (read
Bahamas since Nassau was involved) where be became the Royal Governor.
Richard was also, there serving on the Court of that Colony at one time.
He met and married Sarah Wingfield about 1694, the only child of Martha
and John Wingfield of the islands.
The Wingfields have a world-wide family association that maintains a data base in Dallas TX and a full-time genealogist in England. Some correspondence with them several years ago is partially confirmed by King but, true or not, it's a great story. In brief, a pirate (there are nicer names for it) arrived in Nassau with a cargo said to have been captured from the Grand Mogul of India's flagship in the Indian Ocean. He negotiated with the Governor of the Bahamas (Jones had left by then) and he and his men were granted pardons and passage to England. The Gov retired shortly thereafter. Subsequent investigation uncovered nothing illegal. Richard T was present at the time.
Richard Talliferro's mother-in-law Martha Wingfield came for a visit in 1709 and traveled on to Boston, with many large trunks, to die there on 23 Jul 1709. Her Will left all her property, located in the Bermudas, Bahamas, Boston and Virginia to her daughter Sarah Taliaferro. Richard died in 1715, his wife in 1718, and his only son in 1721, leaving all the property to their remaining 3 daughters, the oldest being married in 1714 to Thosmas Turner Sr. c1690-1758. She (Martha) died in 1726 and he remarried to her sister Sarah Taliaferro as his second wife. The third daughter married Rice Hooe IV and died without issue.
Turner became one of the wealthiest people on either side of the Rapphannock in a very short time, buying up land in Richmond, King George, Caroline, Spotsylvania, etc.. He had a descendant in the 1960s still living there, descended from Tom Turner Sr and both his Taliaferro wives.
MISCELLANY
This being the season of America's family pilgrimages, it may be well to remember travel as our ancestors knew it. The journey from England to America was fraught with delayed schedules, arrival at the wrong destination, lost luggage, spoiled cargo, nd add to that: turbulent seas, hurricanes, bad food, bad water, lack of privacy, disease, death, pirates, treachery and skullduggery of all kinds. Read on . . . .
11 May 1625. Thomas Hamon of Limehouse, Middlesex, sailor aged 25. In 1624 he went as boatswain of the Unity, Mr.Tobias White, for a voyage to Virginia, Canada or New England. The ship was owned by Henry Beale and Peter Leonard who freighted her to Humphrey Rastell and --- Griffith. She left the Thames on 9 Aprl 1624 and took up a course for Virginia but, since the year was far spent, Rastell changed the orders and directed White to sail for New England where she arrived on 24 June. There she made ready to carry her passengers on to virginia but Rastell then embarked them on another vessel on which he sailed himself. Three months after his departure the Unity was ready to leave New England for London, but Captain Wolverstone received orders from Rastell that she was to proceed instead to Virginia. On 21 November 1624 the Unity sailed on a course for Virginia with 6 passengers from New England and collected bread and provisions from Mountheginge Island. She then encountered contrary winds for most of a month, at the end of which all hope of reaching Virginia was abandoned and course was set for England. She arrived back at the end of Februrary 1625.
16 April 1638. William Cleybourne of Virginia, Esq. He has had dealings in Virginia for many years. He sent Lieutenant Ratcliffe Warren in a little boat armed with a gun into Maryland to demand the return of a pinnace and goods which the Marylanders had taken from him. He does not remember the occasion perfectly, but recalls that he signed a letter for Warren to take with him. Inhabitants of the Isle of kent suffered extreme want because their pinbnaces and goods were taken from them by the Marylanders and persuaded the deponent to give them leave to recover them. Lieutenant Warren returned to the Isle of Kent with a boat which the deponent gave into the custody of the Governor of Maryland.
25 July 1637. Philip Callow of Bristol, cooper aged 20. He joined the Blessing of Falmouth, Mr. Philip Luxon, at Padtow, Cornwall, for a voyage to Virginia as her steward. While she was at James Town he forbade the Master to break open cases on board but despite this he opened and consumed a case of strong waters and forced the deponent to drink with him. It was discovered that the crew had cut a way into the ship's hold to get at the drink. On the return voyage some of her company deserted in Ireland, thereby causing her tobacco to be neglected and spoiled.
5 April 1652. Henry Groome of Redriffe, Surrey, aged 48. He was Master's mate of the Adventure, Mr. Thomas Graves, which left Boston, New England, for London on 31 December 1651. On passage whe was damaged by violent storms and had to be refitted before she arrived in London on 4 March 1652. There were 40 men in her company and she carried 80 passengers from New England who were safely delivered in London. Her owner was Francis Willoughby of New England.
5 April 1725. James Williams of Boston, New England, mariner aged
26. In July 1724 at Amsterdam he shipped on the galley George, Mr.
Oliver Fourneau, a Frenchman, for a voyage to Santa Cruz where she loaded
beeswax, copper and other goods. Four months out of Santa Cruz 5
of her company rose up against Fourneau who was shot with a pistol and
thrown overboard. The surgeon John Guy, the mate Bonadventure Jelfs,
and the Master's clerk or supercargo, all had their throats cut while they
lay in their hammocks and were also thrown overboard. She was then
made a pirate ship and renamed the Revenge. John Smith, who had been
her mate and gunner, being the only one left who understood navigation,
was given command and the cook was appointed gunner. They then took a sloop
of Poole named the Delight, Mr. Thomas Wise, which was bound to Cadiz from
Newfoundland, the Batchelor which was laden with timber, and a French vessel
bound from Cadiz to France. The deponent was obliged to remain on
board during all this time but then, having quarreled with one of the pirates,
John Winter, was put aboard a small Bristol ship together with John Brown
and John Bembrick and carried to Lisbon where he was taken on board the
Argyle. He never had any share in the pirate's mone of plunder except
that th bought the surgeon's scarlet cloth jacket and breeches he now wears
from the man who cut his throat.
__________________________________________________
TALIAFERRO TIMES: Compiled from email and other sources
Distributed by Joyce Browning
cJBrown7169@AOL.com
11 December 1996